Wants to learn . . .

[Kel]

I want to learn Java and C++ to further my career as a freelancer. Currently,
I work in advertising but would like to make a move to an IT profession.
People with skills in theses programming languages are highly in demand,
especially in New York City. Is it possible to learn these skills in 6 months
and be at an average skill level? Has anyone freelanced as a programmer
or consultant? Any information/ direction would be greatly appreciated .
. . have a lovely day . . .Kel

[Patrick Lentz]

I wanna start freelancing in two or three years myself. I just started Java
two months ago and have previous Visual Basic experience.
Here's what I think..as a freelancer you need more than average knowledge..if
you work for a company it's okay to ask other programmers with more experience,
but companies hire freelancers with the thought in mind to be hirng an ace
that can work independantly and are prepared to pay accordingly ( as in real
good money).

To become average in any language depends on your skills in thinking logically
and math skills to some extend. So the education you had before matters.
I would say you could become average in Visual Basic in maybe 9 months or
so,depending how fast you pick it up.It's the fastes language to learn and
thus the pay will be the lowest (though still nice).
You could be average in Jave in 1.5 years if you want to be able to work
with databaseconnection and beans and such and again work pretty independant.
C++ is like half a year longer..this is the hardest langauge to learn.
If I were you..since you don't have any previous programming experience I
would either begin with VB or Java..You can then either start faster with
VB and make less or invest more time and take up Java and get more money.
If you think you might get discouraged if you still can't do much after having
invested a lot of weekends reading books and puzzling over exercises you
might want to start with VB..it gives you the feeling of already being able
to do a lot after a month of studying..You can already make database connection,red
from it and write to it and make pretty nice user interfaces (the things
you see on the screen,like buttons and textfields and such) From there you
can always take up Java after having programmed in that for a while....and
if you wait a bit..the new VB has some extra features that you will later
find back in Java ( it becomes a bit more object oriented).
Hope this doesnt discourage you...it's just good I think to be realistic..that
way you set goals that are actually achievable and thus won't be disappointed
by not reaching any of the set goals if you expect too much too fast.

Good luck !

"Kel" <kellyblush@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>I want to learn Java and C++ to further my career as a freelancer. Currently,
>I work in advertising but would like to make a move to an IT profession.
> People with skills in theses programming languages are highly in demand,
>especially in New York City. Is it possible to learn these skills in 6
months
>and be at an average skill level? Has anyone freelanced as a programmer
>or consultant? Any information/ direction would be greatly appreciated

[Dan Nuttle]

I don't entirely agree with the first response. First, I think you can pick
up VB as fast as you want to. Nine months sounds like a reasonable, but
still arbitrary figure to me. If you have any previous programming experience,
and you are willing to spend all of your free time learning, it can be quite
a bit less than nine months. On the other hand, if you have zero experience,
and you want to spend maybe an hour every Saturday, then nine months probably
isn't long enough. (Admittedly, to become an expert in any language takes
years of experience. But you don't have to be an expert to get a job. TRUST
ME. I've seen incompetent people get hired with ZERO experience and come
to work the first day with a "Learn MS Access Visually" book in tow. DOH!!!)

Second, personally I would recommend learning Active Server Pages before
VB. For one thing, I think it's easier. For another, at least here in Chicago,
there are plenty of jobs for it. More than for VB. (Of course, VB is also
an excellent skill to have.) Besides, all you need to learn ASP is MS Personal
Web Server, which is free. Nothing to buy (except a couple of books).

And third, I don't know that companies always expect contract programmers
to be "aces". What they actually expect is that you can get the job done.
If getting the job done involves sometimes asking more experienced developers
for a little help, and the company is amenable to that, then you don't have
to be an ace. When I started contract programming, I had a fair amount of
knowledge, but I certainly wasn't an ace. Yet, in every single contract
assignment I had, I almost immediately became the "guru" that everyone else
came to with their questions. I'm not bragging--my point is that a lot of
the time, the other programmers you'll meet won't be all that advanced themselves,
even the ones who have been doing it for three or four years. There's a
tendency to learn a narrow set of skills, then ride that skill set for all
it's worth and not pick up anything else. The moral: The path to rapid
career success is using what you know, while CONSTANTLY, ALWAYS learning
new things in your own time.

But overall, I agree. I got into contract programming about 2 years ago,
and now I'm a permanent employee of my most recent contract assignment.
I had been programming off and on for a good 10 years, going way back to
things like the Lotus 123 macro language, Clarion, and HyperPad, if anybody
can remember those. I bought the first version of VB for Windows just as
soon as it came out, and I've been playing around with VBA ever since Excel
5.0, the first program that had it. So I had a lot of background experience
before I dived into programming. But it still proves that you don't have
to be a formally trained programmer to get a good job. The main thing is,
do you love programming? Do you get a kick out of developing an application
and seeing it work? Do you just get a kick out of building ANYthing, and
then standing back and admiring your work? If so, and if you have an analytical
mind (translation: a penchant for Boolean logic), then you have what it
takes.

Keep in mind that real-world programming, outside of games, also involves
databases, so you need to get as much experience there as you can, too.
First create some Access databases, and learn how to connect to and manipulate
them. Whatever language you pick as your first, you'll need to learn about
SQL too. Then try to find a way to get access to a database server, like
SQL Server or Oracle. (There are desktop versions of both of these programs
available.) Learn not only to read data from these databases, but how to
create and manage tables. Combine some ASP skill with some HTML knowledge
and the ability to manage data in at least one kind of database server, and
I guarantee your phone will be ringing with job offers.

All of that being said, one thing you and anyone else considering a career
in IT should know, is that you'll be putting yourself on a treadmill that
never stops. Be prepared to learn new skills from now until you retire,
or the day you choose to get out of IT. The industry turns itself inside
out every 3 years or so. And there are a whole gaggle of COBOL programmers
who rode the Y2K wave and are now finding it harder to get work than those
with Java, VB, COM, Oracle, and other, newer skills. That sounds cool, and
exciting, but believe me, it's also tiring. There are times when the clouds
clear, so to speak, and I realize that the mountain I've been climbing, and
whose peak I reached last week, has grown another 12,000 feet overnight,
and it can make me despair that I'll ever get to the top again. On the other
hand, it beats standing on top of a molehill and thumping my chest and yelling,
"I am the KING" for 25 years. Heh heh.

Good luck!

[Val]

Dun i am proficient in ASP , VB and other languages , including knowledge
of databases. Have a position opened in your area ? Let me know i'll send
you a resume.

[Ethan Allen]

"Kel" <kellyblush@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>I want to learn Java and C++ to further my career as a freelancer. Currently,
>I work in advertising but would like to make a move to an IT profession.
> People with skills in theses programming languages are highly in demand,
>especially in New York City. Is it possible to learn these skills in 6
months
>and be at an average skill level? Has anyone freelanced as a programmer
>or consultant? Any information/direction would be greatly appreciated .
>. . have a lovely day . . .Kel


Kelly:

I'm a freelance consultant in the Midwest and I've been doing Java and C++
for some years.
These are my opinions, for what they are worth:

You can reach a reasonable skill level with Java in 6 months, but it would
require working at
learning concepts and techniques many days a week. My belief about this
is based on the
classes I teach at a local technical school; several of my students have
entered the IT market
as Java developers, and two of them learned Java as their first programming
language.

Most people could not learn C++ in 6 months; in my experience it takes around
a year to be
productive with C++.

The difficulty, as I am sure you know, will lie in convincing clients that
you have mastered the
new skills. It is possible to obtain certification as a Java programmer
from Sun (this is possible
in 6 months) which certainly has shown some value in salary surveys. I would
certainly recommend
obtaining this certification - it will give you confidence in your new skills
as very few Java pros can
pass this test. Around here you can ease into the business by subcontracting
through an established
consulting firm.

Anyway I think that there is no reason you should not go full steam ahead
and acquire these new
skills ! Good luck !

Hope this helps ...
Ethan Allen
Allen-Conrad LLC

[Sean Drucker]

"Kel" <kellyblush@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>I want to learn Java and C++ to further my career as a freelancer. Currently,
>I work in advertising but would like to make a move to an IT profession.
> People with skills in theses programming languages are highly in demand,
>especially in New York City. Is it possible to learn these skills in 6
months
>and be at an average skill level? Has anyone freelanced as a programmer
>or consultant? Any information/ direction would be greatly appreciated

[David Gagniere]

"Kel" <kellyblush@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>I want to learn Java and C++ to further my career as a freelancer. Currently,
>I work in advertising but would like to make a move to an IT profession.
> People with skills in theses programming languages are highly in demand,
>especially in New York City. Is it possible to learn these skills in 6
months
>and be at an average skill level? Has anyone freelanced as a programmer
>or consultant? Any information/ direction would be greatly appreciated

[Ben Leadholm]

"Kel" <kellyblush@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>I want to learn Java and C++ to further my career as a freelancer. ....
Is it possible to learn these skills in 6 months
>and be at an average skill level? Has anyone freelanced as a programmer
>or consultant? Any information/ direction would be greatly appreciated