Disturbing trend

[Phil Weber]

I've noticed a trend in this group over the past week or so that troubles
me. Here's the scenario:

An individual posts a question and receives a reply or two. These replies do
not fully solve the individual's problem, however, so he posts a followup
question as a new message, completely unrelated to the existing conversation
("thread," in newsgroup parlance).

Or, perhaps the original post doesn't receive any replies within three or
four hours, so the individual reposts the question, stressing that he's
"desperate" and his problem is "urgent."

Now, I understand that when you're stuck on a programming problem, that
problem can seem like the most important thing in the world to you. But
these discussion groups are a community; they don't exist to serve as any
individual's personal tech support line. That being the case, I'd like to
make a request, and remind everyone of one of our rules.

First, the request: after you've posted a question, please keep all
discussion related to that question in a single message thread. That means
any followup messages should be posted as replies to an existing message.
Why? Because that way, when another user searches the newsgroup for an
answer to her question, she'll be able to find all discussion of a given
topic in one place (the Web interface to these groups has a "Related Items"
button that allows a person to see all messages in a thread, but not if
they're scattered across numerous threads).

Now, the rule: according to the newsgroup rules
( http://news.devx.com/newspolicy.asp ), questions are not to be reposted
unless they have gone unanswered for "a couple of days." That means 48
hours. We do not offer a "same day service" guarantee. :-)

Thank you all for your cooperation. As a result of your participation, these
groups are among the best technical resources on the 'Net. Please help us
keep it that way. Thanks!
---
Phil Weber
DevX Newsgroup Admin

[Jim]

>As a result of your participation, these
>groups are among the best technical resources on the 'Net. >Please help
us
>keep it that way. Thanks!

Hear ... hear .... and AMEN !

Jim

[Jim Edgar]

How about a reminder to use a _pertinent_ subject line. Personally I ignore
subject lines such as:

BEGINNER NEEDS HELP!, DESPERATE: NEED HELP! or HELP!!!!!!!

Take off the caps lock and use a subject line like:

How do I get printer margins?, How do I use the Shell() function?, or Why
should I use a Sub Main() at startup?

You'll probably get a quicker response.

Oh yeah, and don't forget to say thanks to the person(s) that help you...

Jim Edgar

"Jim" <jdmcjen(ThisGottaGo)@alltel.net> wrote in message
news:3910e328$1@news.devx.com...
>
> >As a result of your participation, these
> >groups are among the best technical resources on the 'Net. >Please help
> us
> >keep it that way. Thanks!
>
> Hear ... hear .... and AMEN !
>
> Jim
>

[Jim Pragit]

Phil,

Maybe adding a direct link to the newsgroup etiquette page from each newsgroup
might help. I know there's a link on the Welcome page, but if most people
are like me, they have bookmarks to each individual newsgroup and thus bypass
the Welcome page. A nice, friendly "Help" button next to the "Post" button
might do the trick.

- Jim

"Phil Weber" <pweber@teleport.com> wrote:
>I've noticed a trend in this group over the past week or so that troubles
>me. Here's the scenario:
>
>An individual posts a question and receives a reply or two. These replies
do
>not fully solve the individual's problem, however, so he posts a followup
>question as a new message, completely unrelated to the existing conversation
>("thread," in newsgroup parlance).
>
>Or, perhaps the original post doesn't receive any replies within three or
>four hours, so the individual reposts the question, stressing that he's
>"desperate" and his problem is "urgent."
>
>Now, I understand that when you're stuck on a programming problem, that
>problem can seem like the most important thing in the world to you. But
>these discussion groups are a community; they don't exist to serve as any
>individual's personal tech support line. That being the case, I'd like to
>make a request, and remind everyone of one of our rules.
>
>First, the request: after you've posted a question, please keep all
>discussion related to that question in a single message thread. That means
>any followup messages should be posted as replies to an existing message.
>Why? Because that way, when another user searches the newsgroup for an
>answer to her question, she'll be able to find all discussion of a given
>topic in one place (the Web interface to these groups has a "Related Items"
>button that allows a person to see all messages in a thread, but not if
>they're scattered across numerous threads).
>
>Now, the rule: according to the newsgroup rules
>( http://news.devx.com/newspolicy.asp ), questions are not to be reposted
>unless they have gone unanswered for "a couple of days." That means 48
>hours. We do not offer a "same day service" guarantee. :-)
>
>Thank you all for your cooperation. As a result of your participation, these
>groups are among the best technical resources on the 'Net. Please help us
>keep it that way. Thanks!
>---
>Phil Weber
>DevX Newsgroup Admin
>
>

[Paul Clement]

On Wed, 3 May 2000 17:14:48 -0700, "Phil Weber" <pweber@teleport.com> wrote:


¤ First, the request: after you've posted a question, please keep all
¤ discussion related to that question in a single message thread. That means
¤ any followup messages should be posted as replies to an existing message.

Consider yourself thanked by all Forte Agent newreader users. ;-)

(Assuming you also mean that posters don't modify the title of their responses).


Paul ~~~ pclement@ameritech.net
Microsoft MVP (Visual Basic)

[Phil Weber]

> Maybe adding a direct link to the newsgroup etiquette
> page from each newsgroup might help.

Jim: Good suggestion, thanks! We already have a link at the bottom of the
page when you read a message, but none when you're browsing a group or
composing a message. I'll add them ASAP.
---
Phil Weber

[Brad Isaacs]

Hi Phil,

Ok, so I now know the rules and I promise you that when I repost a message
it will follow the thread properlly.

Although the replies to my questions have not really helped me all that much,
I am however reading alot more and thus feel if know one can help me here
right away I will have to just figure this out on my own.

I do however think that someone could help me and I shall wait until that
happens. In the mean time I shall keep working on my problem of ...

How to bind a DataReport that is inside a Data Enviorment using ADO together
with a dbcombo box connected in DAO to find a particular DataReport?

Sorry for all the trouble I have caused you and the others at Devx, as I
hope NOT to be known as a pest on your web site.

Yours Sincerely,

Brad Isaacs
(Junior Vb 6.0 programmer working for a small company)

[Larry Rebich]

Phil,

Have you ever checked out the comp.lang.basic.visual... forums? They are a
mess. Thanks for the devx ones.

And thanks for keeping a tight rein.

Cheers,
Larry Rebich

larry@buygold.net
www.buygold.net


"Phil Weber" <pweber@teleport.com> wrote in message
news:3910c05c$1@news.devx.com...
> I've noticed a trend in this group over the past week or so that troubles
> me. Here's the scenario:
>
> An individual posts a question and receives a reply or two. These replies
do
> not fully solve the individual's problem, however, so he posts a followup
> question as a new message, completely unrelated to the existing
conversation
> ("thread," in newsgroup parlance).
>
> Or, perhaps the original post doesn't receive any replies within three or
> four hours, so the individual reposts the question, stressing that he's
> "desperate" and his problem is "urgent."
>
> Now, I understand that when you're stuck on a programming problem, that
> problem can seem like the most important thing in the world to you. But
> these discussion groups are a community; they don't exist to serve as any
> individual's personal tech support line. That being the case, I'd like to
> make a request, and remind everyone of one of our rules.
>
> First, the request: after you've posted a question, please keep all
> discussion related to that question in a single message thread. That means
> any followup messages should be posted as replies to an existing message.
> Why? Because that way, when another user searches the newsgroup for an
> answer to her question, she'll be able to find all discussion of a given
> topic in one place (the Web interface to these groups has a "Related
Items"
> button that allows a person to see all messages in a thread, but not if
> they're scattered across numerous threads).
>
> Now, the rule: according to the newsgroup rules
> ( http://news.devx.com/newspolicy.asp ), questions are not to be reposted
> unless they have gone unanswered for "a couple of days." That means 48
> hours. We do not offer a "same day service" guarantee. :-)
>
> Thank you all for your cooperation. As a result of your participation,
these
> groups are among the best technical resources on the 'Net. Please help us
> keep it that way. Thanks!
> ---
> Phil Weber
> DevX Newsgroup Admin
>
>

[Kathleen Dollard-Joeris]

Jim,

> How do I get printer margins?, How do I use the Shell() function?, or Why
> should I use a Sub Main() at startup?

I don't like any of those subjects. I know we can search, but I still think
sorting helps. How about

Shell()-How do I use it
Printer margins-retrieving values
Sub Main()-Why bother?

--
Kathleen
(MS-MVP)
Reply in the newsgroup so everyone can benefit
--

[Kathleen Dollard-Joeris]

Phil,

Agreed, but I want to point out that the opposite problem, allowing
excessive thread drift, is just as much a problem. There is a balance, and
just because folks went too far one way doesn't mean they should go the
other way.

I'd also like to remind folks they can modify the subject within a thread
(does that mess up any readers?) So you can add "2ND POST-HELP" to the
original subject to help catch somebody's eye. Or at least put something
like that as the first line of the message.

--
Kathleen
(MS-MVP)
Reply in the newsgroup so everyone can benefit
--

[Kathleen Dollard-Joeris]

> (Assuming you also mean that posters don't modify the title of their
responses).

Oops,

I just posted something suggesting people change their subjects.

Should I retract that?

--
Kathleen
(MS-MVP)
Reply in the newsgroup so everyone can benefit
--

[Phil Weber]

> Agreed, but I want to point out that the opposite problem,
> allowing excessive thread drift, is just as much a problem.

Kathleen: Of course. Note that I said, "Please keep all discussion *related
to that question* in a single message thread." Once the discussion is no
longer related to the original question (a.k.a. "thread drift"), by all
means feel free to start a new thread.
---
Phil Weber

[Jim Edgar]

> > How do I get printer margins?, How do I use the Shell() function?, or
Why
> > should I use a Sub Main() at startup?
>
> I don't like any of those subjects. I know we can search, but I still
think
> sorting helps.

Sorry -- you're right.

Jim Edgar

[Kathleen Dollard-Joeris]

Phil,

But what about my other suggestion of changing the subject with by adding a
"2ND POST" or something. Paul Clement suggested that this caused a problem
for Agent. I don't know enough about other readers to know what works best
for most people.

--
Kathleen
(MS-MVP)
Reply in the newsgroup so everyone can benefit
--
Phil Weber <pweber@teleport.com> wrote in message
news:3912e7a7$1@news.devx.com...
> > Agreed, but I want to point out that the opposite problem,
> > allowing excessive thread drift, is just as much a problem.
>
> Kathleen: Of course. Note that I said, "Please keep all discussion
*related
> to that question* in a single message thread." Once the discussion is no
> longer related to the original question (a.k.a. "thread drift"), by all
> means feel free to start a new thread.
> ---
> Phil Weber
>
>

[Phil Weber]

> But what about my other suggestion of changing the
> subject by adding a "2ND POST" or something? Paul
> Clement suggested that this caused a problem for Agent.

Kathleen: The "problem" that is causes is that the new subject appears in
Agent as a separate thread, so whether one starts a new thread or changes
the subject heading, the post looks the same in Agent.

By replying within the thread, however (whether or not one changes the
subject), the "Related Items" feature of our Web interface is able to
recognize that the messages are related, which doesn't happen if one starts
a new thread. So I would prefer that people who repost a question do so as a
reply to the original post, and change the subject heading to indicate that
it's a repost.
---
Phil Weber