Yag's status report - Jan 31, 2002

[Yair Alan Griver [MSFT]]

Status Report - Jan. 31, 2002



Hey folks,



Here's my latest status report - just to let everyone know what I've been up
to. I'll be posting these occasionally to let you know what's coming down
the pike.



1.. I've been setting up the infrastructure so that we can standardize on
having a chat around 3 weeks after some of our whitepapers. Then we'll link
from the chat transcript to the whitepaper. Gives people a chance to read up
on a topic, and then get assistance on it as well.
2.. I'm working with the product team to set up regular "Newsgroup and Web
Site" blasts - where we'd get together in a room for an hour and answer
messages online. Watch this space for more info as it gells.
3.. Once #2 is set up, we're thinking of setting up a "topical blast"
where a topic would be selected, folks could post messages for a week, and
then we'd come online and work on those questions and set up white papers on
it as well.
4.. I got community feedback into an upcoming whitepaper on .NET and
Interop - thanks to everyone who helped out - I'll let you know when the
paper comes out!


Upcoming chats (http://msdn.microsoft.com/chats):

Windows Forms
Tuesday, February 12, 2002, 1:00 - 2:00 P.M. Pacific time (21:00 - 22:00
GMT)
While this session will initially cover the material in the "Essential Code
for Windows Forms Dialog Boxes", "Shaped Windows Forms and Controls in
Visual Studio .NET", and "Using Windows XP Visual Styles With Controls on
Windows Forms" whitepapers, please feel free to ask any Windows
Forms-related questions you may have.

Under The Covers With the Common Language Runtime
Thursday, January 31, 2002, 12:00 - 1:00 P.M. Pacific time (20:00 - 21:00
GMT)
The common language runtime (CLR) is the core of the .NET Framework. Built
on top of operating system services, it is responsible for executing .NET
applications-ensuring that all application dependencies are met, managing
memory, handling security, language integration and so on. The runtime
supplies many services that help simplify code development and application
deployment while also improving application reliability. Brad Abrams, .NET
Framework Lead Program Manager and Jim Hogg, Common Language Runtime Program
Manager, will be available to answer your questions about CLR.

.NET Remoting
Friday, February 1, 2002, 3:00 - 4:00 P.M. Pacific time (23:00 - 24:00 GMT)
The .NET Remoting development team will address your questions about .NET
Remoting, including how .NET Remoting can be used to create distributed
applications with .NET and how it can be extended with pluggable channels,
formatters and other powerful extensibility points. The chat will also cover
security, configuration and versioning.

XML Web Services Interoperability
Thursday, February 7, 2002, 12:00 - 1:00 P.M. Pacific time (20:00 - 21:00
GMT)
The promise of XML Web services rests on interoperability and ubiquity. Open
standards and rigorous multi-vendor testing ensure that a rich community of
Web services implementations will proliferate. Join us in this session with
Keith Ballinger and Yann Christensen from the team that brought you ASP.NET'
s Web services stack as we discuss Microsoft's work in XML Web services
interoperability.


Executive Chat with Jim Allchin: Visual Studio .NET
Tuesday, February 12, 2002, 3:00 - 4:00 P.M. Pacific time (23:00 - 24:00
GMT)
Visual Studio .NET is the comprehensive tool for rapidly building and
integrating XML Web services and applications, dramatically increasing
developer productivity and enabling new business opportunities. Talk to Jim
Allchin, Microsoft Group Vice President, about how Visual Studio .NET
improves developer productivity and enables new business opportunities.


Get Into the Visual Studio .NET Integrated Development Environment
Wednesday, February 13, 2002, 4:00 - 5:00 P.M. Pacific time (24:00 - 1:00
GMT)
Visual Studio .NET provides a single shared integrated development
environment (IDE) to improve developer productivity and to provide an
extensible foundation for 3rd party .NET languages and tools. In this
session Doug Hodges, Software Architect for the IDE, will be available to
answer your questions and provide tips and tricks for improving your
development productivity.


Executive Chat with Eric Rudder: Global XML Web Services Architecture
Monday, February 18, 2002, 4:00 - 5:00 P.M. Pacific time (24:00 - 1:00 GMT)
The Global XML Web Services Architecture (GXA) provides principles,
specifications and guidelines for advancing today's XML Web services
standards. This allows XML Web services to address more sophisticated and
complex tasks in standard ways. Through the GXA, XML Web services will
continue to advance while remaining the interoperable fabric of application
internetworking. Microsoft Senior Vice President Eric Rudder will be
available to answer your questions about the GXA and what it means for XML
Web services.


Executive Chat with Yuval Neeman: Enterprise Development
Wednesday, February 20, 2002, 3:00 - 4:00 P.M. Pacific time (23:00 - 24:00
GMT)
Enterprise product development, in many ways, is very similar to traditional
development. However, enterprise customers tend to be very systematic as
opposed to opportunistic in their approach to building applications.
Successfully building complex enterprise applications requires a solid
architecture and a common understanding of requirements across the
development team. Talk to Yuval Neeman, Microsoft Vice President, about
Enterprise development challenges today and how Visual Studio .NET
Enterprise toolset addresses some of these challenges including design,
development, deployment and security.


Visual Studio .NET Enterprise Architect Tools
Tuesday, April 2, 2002, 2:00 - 3:00 P.M. Pacific time (22:00 - 23:00 GMT)
Successfully building complex enterprise applications requires a solid
architecture and a common understanding of requirements across the
development team. The role of an architect is typically to help their
organizations build applications that scale, integrate with existing
systems, fulfill business requirements, and be maintainable over multiple
versions of the product. In this session, Keith Short, Software Architect
for enterprise features within Visual Studio will answer your questions
about the tools Visual Studio .NET Enterprise Architect provides for
architects to build enterprise applications in a systematic, repeatable and
predictable manner.



White Papers released this week - available from
http://msdn.microsoft.com/net/guide/ (dates after the title are tentative
chat dates):



Creating Web Server Control Templates Programmatically (2/19/02)

Illustrates how to create templates in code for the Repeater, DataList, and
DataGrid ASP.NET server controls, showing examples in both Visual Basic .NET
and Visual C# .NET.

Top Questions about the DataGrid Web Server Control (3/19/02)

Answers frequently asked questions about using the DataGrid Web server
control.

Working with Single-File Web Forms Pages in Visual Studio .NET (3/21/02)

Provides an overview of single-file Web Forms pages, how to work with
single-file pages in Visual Studio, and how to convert single-file Web Forms
pages to code-behind Web Forms pages.

[John Butler]

"Yair Alan Griver [MSFT]" <yag@microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:3c59a9a1$1@10.1.10.29...
> Status Report - Jan. 31, 2002
> .NET Remoting
> Friday, February 1, 2002, 3:00 - 4:00 P.M. Pacific time (23:00 - 24:00
GMT)

eek 23:00 GMT.... that's a seriously anti-social time... I'm a sad
*******...but not that sad!!!

[Jay Glynn]

2 questions on the chats.

Will there be transcripts available?
Can we supply questions beforehand in case we are not available for the
chat?

[Steve]

Yeh, and Buffy's on at 23.35 GMT!

Steve

"John Butler" <nospamjrbutler@btinternet.com> wrote in message
news:3c59d886$1@10.1.10.29...
>
> "Yair Alan Griver [MSFT]" <yag@microsoft.com> wrote in message
> news:3c59a9a1$1@10.1.10.29...
> > Status Report - Jan. 31, 2002
> > .NET Remoting
> > Friday, February 1, 2002, 3:00 - 4:00 P.M. Pacific time (23:00 - 24:00
> GMT)
>
> eek 23:00 GMT.... that's a seriously anti-social time... I'm a sad
> *******...but not that sad!!!
>
>

[Yair Alan Griver [MSFT]]

LOL... That ain't what I heard... <g>

Sorry - couldn't resist.

We'll be sure to post the transcript for people who can't attend live...

yag

"John Butler" <nospamjrbutler@btinternet.com> wrote in message
news:3c59d886$1@10.1.10.29...
>
> "Yair Alan Griver [MSFT]" <yag@microsoft.com> wrote in message
> news:3c59a9a1$1@10.1.10.29...
> > Status Report - Jan. 31, 2002
> > .NET Remoting
> > Friday, February 1, 2002, 3:00 - 4:00 P.M. Pacific time (23:00 - 24:00
> GMT)
>
> eek 23:00 GMT.... that's a seriously anti-social time... I'm a sad
> *******...but not that sad!!!
>
>

[Yair Alan Griver [MSFT]]

Yes and yes. Not all the questions will necessarily make it into the chats -
but we do save those as ideas for future white papers also...

Just post the questions here or email them to me directly - I'll make sure
that they're handled...

yag


"Jay Glynn" <jlsglynn@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:3c59f492$1@10.1.10.29...
> 2 questions on the chats.
>
> Will there be transcripts available?
> Can we supply questions beforehand in case we are not available for the
> chat?
>
>
>

[Ed]

"Yair Alan Griver [MSFT]" <yag@microsoft.com> wrote:
>Status Report - Jan. 31, 2002
>
>
>
>Executive Chat with Yuval Neeman: Enterprise Development
>Wednesday, February 20, 2002, 3:00 - 4:00 P.M. Pacific time (23:00 - 24:00
>GMT)
>Visual Studio .NET Enterprise Architect Tools
>Tuesday, April 2, 2002, 2:00 - 3:00 P.M. Pacific time (22:00 - 23:00 GMT)
>Successfully building complex enterprise applications requires a solid
>architecture and a common understanding of requirements across the
>development team. The role of an architect is typically to help their
>organizations build applications that scale, integrate with existing
>systems, fulfill business requirements, and be maintainable over multiple
>versions of the product. In this session, Keith Short, Software Architect
>for enterprise features within Visual Studio will answer your questions
>about the tools Visual Studio .NET Enterprise Architect provides for
>architects to build enterprise applications in a systematic, repeatable
and
>predictable manner.
>

VB has to be taken into context of the entire Enterprise Architecture. Some
developers are not concerned about how VB fits in with other products but
anyone developing Enterprise Applications has to take into account databases,
messaging, transactions, security, etc. And they also have to take into account
how they move forward as new versions come out. To date, the entire process
of moving from version to version with Microsoft products is an absolute
nightmare. Trying to juggle W2K upgrades, Active Directory, SQL 2000, Office
XP, security, Exchange, MDAC, etc. is on the verge of being impossible.
Throw in SAP-specific upgrades and how one has to coordinate an SAP ugprade
with upgrades to W2K and SQL 2000 is not trivial excercise.

I was ecstatic when I read the reference architecture - Microsoft Systems
Architecture: Internet Data Center. This is first time I've seen a document
that prescribes a way of using Microsoft technologies to deliver an infrastructure
that addresses a number of enterprise requirements. I'm hoping that Microsoft
will continue with this process and provide references to a new baseline
architecture as technology changes and make recommendations on how to go
from base line 1 to base line 2. There are too many products, versions,
dependencies, for a small to medium size enterprise (SME) to organize and
implement. We need Microsoft to prescribe a path. We need Microsoft to
test their baseline to make sure it adheres to industry best practices and
to make sure that it works. We need Microsoft to prescribe a way to migrate
from one version to another. SMEs need guideance. There are too many ways
of putting all this technology together. I don't have the resources or the
time to figure it out. I need my partner/vendor to prescribe a path.

Ed

[Mike Mitchell]

On 3 Feb 2002 10:41:54 -0800, "Ed" <ed_raffin@hotmail.com> wrote:

> Trying to juggle W2K upgrades, Active Directory, SQL 2000, Office
>XP, security, Exchange, MDAC, etc. is on the verge of being impossible.
>Throw in SAP-specific upgrades and how one has to coordinate an SAP ugprade
>with upgrades to W2K and SQL 2000 is not trivial excercise.

I can heartily agree with this. Microsoft appears to think that every
organisation has an infrastructure as rich as they, with countless
thousands of employees to do ordinary everyday maintenance. For most
companies, developers are there to develop. They just don't have the
time to keep up with all the upgrades, patches, Q articles, and so on.
It is like a never-ending paper chase, and many of the runners are
exhausted and dropping by the wayside.

MM

[Dave Keighan]

Hi Mike
[...]
> don't have the time to keep up with all the
> upgrades, patches, Q articles, and so on. It
> is like a never-ending paper chase, and many
> of the runners are exhausted and dropping by
> the wayside.
Can't dispute this Mike. I've been just keeping my nose just out of the
water from version to version and never do seem to get any further ahead
but as a hobbyist (which IMO is part of the problem it's not all that
significant.

*** OT Comments ***
IMO Enterprisers are now officially the target, it's been moving that
way since early VB, they've been using the tool hard and were a big part
of making it a contender by pushing MS and proving VB - I don't think it'd
be what it is today without them. Too bad they PO'd so many of them in the
process - which they seem to be trying to amend. Making VB 'the tool to
use' has created some difficulties along the way.

Broken code and learning curve aside (taking a global look) don't you
think VB.Net is what it takes to make VB the tool that solves all (ok
most) of the old gripes (beginners tool, toy, runtimes, yada-yada-yada)?
Yes I do believe that it could have been done differently but I also think
that doing it that way would have either left us out of the big picture
completely or having to make the transition over several versions - with
the same result. One way or the other MS tools will run on Net - the boss
says so.

I've always contended (before I got over the/my runtimes bellyache) that
they could just add a translator that would move the VB code into
whatever it takes to make standalone apps but I also know that if it was
possible they'd have done by now - DUH! Probably why I'm still a hobbyist.

It's their ball, you wanna play you gotta play their way. It makes you
feel bad if you don't like the new game/rules but you get over it and
things are fun again.

--
Dave Keighan
VB Hobbyist - Versions DOS/3/5/6

[Mike Mitchell]

On 3 Feb 2002 15:39:34 -0800, Dave Keighan <dkeighan@hotmail.com>
wrote:

>It's their ball, you wanna play you gotta play their way.

I don't want to play any longer. I am planning on a career change.
Selling Linux!

MM

[Phil Weber]

> It is like a never-ending paper chase, and many of the
> runners are exhausted and dropping by the wayside.

Mike: Which means more demand and higher pay for the survivors. If just
anyone could create professional-quality software, we'd be the equivalent of
Wal-Mart employees, and would be paid accordingly.
---
Phil Weber

[Mike Mitchell]

On Mon, 4 Feb 2002 07:45:07 -0800, "Phil Weber"
<pweber@nospam.fawcette.com> wrote:

> > It is like a never-ending paper chase, and many of the
> > runners are exhausted and dropping by the wayside.
>
>Mike: Which means more demand and higher pay for the survivors.

And they don't get to see their kids. And they put in 60 hours or more
a week. And they're continually stressed out. And they die of heart
attacks.

Sure, greed works for some people.

MM

[Phil Weber]

> And they don't get to see their kids. And they put in 60
> hours or more a week. And they're continually stressed
> out. And they die of heart attacks. Sure, greed works
> for some people.

Mike: You assume that I'm greedy because I want to receive a higher hourly
rate? In fact, I want to be able to work as few hours as necessary so that I
have more time available for more important things. If I received Wal-Mart
wages I'd have to work 60-hour weeks; the higher my hourly rate, the fewer
hours I have to work. If that's greed, than I guess I'm guilty.
---
Phil Weber

[Yair Alan Griver [MSFT]]

Thanks for your feedback. I'm gonna make sure this gets around...

yag

"Ed" <ed_raffin@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:3c5d8472$1@10.1.10.29...
>
> "Yair Alan Griver [MSFT]" <yag@microsoft.com> wrote:
> >Status Report - Jan. 31, 2002
> >
> >
> >
> >Executive Chat with Yuval Neeman: Enterprise Development
> >Wednesday, February 20, 2002, 3:00 - 4:00 P.M. Pacific time (23:00 -
24:00
> >GMT)
> >Visual Studio .NET Enterprise Architect Tools
> >Tuesday, April 2, 2002, 2:00 - 3:00 P.M. Pacific time (22:00 - 23:00 GMT)
> >Successfully building complex enterprise applications requires a solid
> >architecture and a common understanding of requirements across the
> >development team. The role of an architect is typically to help their
> >organizations build applications that scale, integrate with existing
> >systems, fulfill business requirements, and be maintainable over multiple
> >versions of the product. In this session, Keith Short, Software Architect
> >for enterprise features within Visual Studio will answer your questions
> >about the tools Visual Studio .NET Enterprise Architect provides for
> >architects to build enterprise applications in a systematic, repeatable
> and
> >predictable manner.
> >
>
> VB has to be taken into context of the entire Enterprise Architecture.
Some
> developers are not concerned about how VB fits in with other products but
> anyone developing Enterprise Applications has to take into account
databases,
> messaging, transactions, security, etc. And they also have to take into
account
> how they move forward as new versions come out. To date, the entire
process
> of moving from version to version with Microsoft products is an absolute
> nightmare. Trying to juggle W2K upgrades, Active Directory, SQL 2000,
Office
> XP, security, Exchange, MDAC, etc. is on the verge of being impossible.
> Throw in SAP-specific upgrades and how one has to coordinate an SAP
ugprade
> with upgrades to W2K and SQL 2000 is not trivial excercise.
>
> I was ecstatic when I read the reference architecture - Microsoft Systems
> Architecture: Internet Data Center. This is first time I've seen a
document
> that prescribes a way of using Microsoft technologies to deliver an
infrastructure
> that addresses a number of enterprise requirements. I'm hoping that
Microsoft
> will continue with this process and provide references to a new baseline
> architecture as technology changes and make recommendations on how to go
> from base line 1 to base line 2. There are too many products, versions,
> dependencies, for a small to medium size enterprise (SME) to organize and
> implement. We need Microsoft to prescribe a path. We need Microsoft to
> test their baseline to make sure it adheres to industry best practices and
> to make sure that it works. We need Microsoft to prescribe a way to
migrate
> from one version to another. SMEs need guideance. There are too many ways
> of putting all this technology together. I don't have the resources or
the
> time to figure it out. I need my partner/vendor to prescribe a path.
>
> Ed
>

[Patrick Troughton]

What stress? Learning is fun. I'm still writing in both VB6 and VB.NET and
I can tell you that I enjoy VB.NET more than VB6. Visual inheritance, for
example, is awesome. It make you wonder how you ever got along without it....

/Pat

kylix_is@yahoo.co.uk (Mike Mitchell) wrote:
>On Mon, 4 Feb 2002 07:45:07 -0800, "Phil Weber"
><pweber@nospam.fawcette.com> wrote:
>
>> > It is like a never-ending paper chase, and many of the
>> > runners are exhausted and dropping by the wayside.
>>
>>Mike: Which means more demand and higher pay for the survivors.
>
>And they don't get to see their kids. And they put in 60 hours or more
>a week. And they're continually stressed out. And they die of heart
>attacks.
>
>Sure, greed works for some people.
>
>MM