Re: Do consumers even want web services? - Page 19


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Thread: Re: Do consumers even want web services?

  1. #271
    John Guest

    Re: Do consumers even want web services?

    > > >> I made the statement that Web Services is not revolutionary. I just
    > find
    > > >it
    > > >> ridiculous how very few people have the ability to view the

    > requirements
    > > >of
    > > >> a project and select the appropriate solution.
    > > >
    > > >Kettle. Pot. Black. Calling.

    > >
    > > wrong. Actually I'm currently developing an EAI solution using MS...b/c
    > > I felt as though that is what the requirements dictated.

    >
    > Do you "have the ability to view the requirements of a project and select
    > the appropriate solution." And, no, just because you selected MS does not
    > mean that you have it. Or perhaps what you meant was that you are one of

    the
    > elite that have the ability and, pretty much everyone else don't?


    uuhhhh...yes. Happy?

    Quite frankly I'm very tired of this thread. You don't seem to understand
    my point (everything has a strength, MS is not the only answer...and I was
    using Java as an example), and perhaps I'm missing yours as well...so I
    suppose that means we are at an impasse.





  2. #272
    Kunle Odutola Guest

    Re: Do consumers even want web services?


    "John" <@> wrote in message news:3c9fb1c3@10.1.10.29...
    > > This is the standard [bullshit] Sun party line but feel free to prove me
    > > wrong: Under what circumstances would you use anything else except Java?

    >
    > done it...and don't feel the need or inclination to prove it to you.


    Thought so.

    > There are various reasons to use MS for a project. For my current project
    > the main reasons are: low number of transactions (1-2 / second at a
    > max).


    Yes. We all know how MS systems can't handle more than 1-2 transactions per
    second don't we.

    http://www.tpc.org/tpcc/results/tpcc_perf_results.asp
    http://www.tpc.org/tpcw/results/tpcw_perf_results.asp

    Kunle



  3. #273
    John Guest

    Re: Do consumers even want web services?

    > > done it...and don't feel the need or inclination to prove it to you.
    >
    > Thought so.


    Just out of curiousity, how would I prove it to you? Pass the source? Give
    a detailed explanation of what I did?
    To get a new client up and running took an average of less than 3 man days
    (disregarding the obvious preparation on their side).

    >
    > > There are various reasons to use MS for a project. For my current

    project
    > > the main reasons are: low number of transactions (1-2 / second at a
    > > max).

    >
    > Yes. We all know how MS systems can't handle more than 1-2 transactions

    per
    > second don't we.
    >
    > http://www.tpc.org/tpcc/results/tpcc_perf_results.asp
    > http://www.tpc.org/tpcw/results/tpcw_perf_results.asp


    Hhmmm...you left off the most important part, which I find typical in your
    posts... Take the whole message, not bits and pieces to craft your own
    message. Here is my original post:

    <EXCERPT>
    There are various reasons to use MS for a project. For my current project
    the main reasons are: low number of transactions (1-2 / second at a
    max)...so Biztalk is acceptable, they are a MS shop, and the systems they
    willl interact with will be MS.
    </EXCERPT>

    So the $64 question is what did you leave out? Do some investigation of the
    part that you left out and then let me know where that product ranks.

    -John



  4. #274
    Kunle Odutola Guest

    Re: Do consumers even want web services?


    "John" <@> wrote in message news:3c9fefb2@10.1.10.29...

    John,

    Ever used Datagate?

    Kunle



  5. #275
    John Guest

    Re: Do consumers even want web services?

    > Ever used Datagate?

    No. Will look into it. What's the skinny?



  6. #276
    Mike Mitchell Guest

    Re: Do consumers even want web services?

    On Mon, 25 Mar 2002 18:52:59 -0500, "John" <@> wrote:

    >Quite frankly I'm very tired of this thread. You don't seem to understand
    >my point (everything has a strength, MS is not the only answer...and I was
    >using Java as an example), and perhaps I'm missing yours as well...so I
    >suppose that means we are at an impasse.


    Perhaps you need me here to head Kunle off at the impasse...

    ....this way! Look, MS are holding a clambake! Ooh, octopus! So many
    tentacles!

    MM

  7. #277
    John Butler Guest

    Re: Do consumers even want web services?


    "John" <@> wrote in message news:3c9e8fca@10.1.10.29...
    > > In the meantime, if you must run on Unix, you can always take the extra

    > time
    > > to develop your stuff with Java, if you don't care about time to market.

    >
    > versus what!?!? C, C++, etc.???? Have you ever developed with Java? I
    > don't think that it's any more time consuming than C#...and certainly less
    > than VC++. Believe it or not, but MS does NOT run many enterprise
    > applications... The big boys ARE ON Unix or similar platforms.


    <Quote>Finally, the complexity of Java itself continues to be a problem. To
    go beyond highly technical programmers and reach mainstream developers,
    analysts say Java software makers have to follow Microsoft's lead in
    easy-to-use programming tools that allow people to build programs simply by
    pointing and clicking. In particular, they criticize a standard technology
    called Enterprise Java Beans, which is actually supposed to save time by
    allowing small pieces of software to be reused. </Quote>

    Full link at: http://zdnet.com.com/2100-1104-868573.html

    (and there are positive points about Java at the link too...)

    rgds
    John Butler





  8. #278
    Mike Mitchell Guest

    Re: Do consumers even want web services?

    On Tue, 26 Mar 2002 23:57:32 -0000, "John Butler"
    <nospamjrbutler@btinternet.com> wrote:

    ><Quote>Finally, the complexity of Java itself continues to be a problem. To
    >go beyond highly technical programmers and reach mainstream developers,
    >analysts say Java software makers have to follow Microsoft's lead in
    >easy-to-use programming tools that allow people to build programs simply by
    >pointing and clicking. In particular, they criticize a standard technology
    >called Enterprise Java Beans, which is actually supposed to save time by
    >allowing small pieces of software to be reused. </Quote>
    >
    >Full link at: http://zdnet.com.com/2100-1104-868573.html
    >
    >(and there are positive points about Java at the link too...)


    If people have recognised the complexity of Java, and C# is,
    basically, a rewrite of Java, is C# any more or less complex? I mean,
    what do I get for my money? With Java's complexity, at least I can
    utilise what I learned on numerous (all!) platforms, so it's kind of
    an impetus to using Java I would think.

    MM

  9. #279
    Kunle Odutola Guest

    Re: Do consumers even want web services?


    "Mike Mitchell" <kylix_is@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
    news:3ca1a9a1.1395680@news.devx.com...

    > If people have recognised the complexity of Java, and C# is,
    > basically, a rewrite of Java, is C# any more or less complex?


    C# the language borrows one (non-exclusive) idea from C++ and Java - based
    your syntax on C. It might even borrow more ideas from Delphi than Java ;-)

    The .NET platform's API has many similarities to Java's API. Not surprising
    given MS's excellent work on the MSJVM, J++.

    > I mean,
    > what do I get for my money? With Java's complexity, at least I can
    > utilise what I learned on numerous (all!) platforms, so it's kind of
    > an impetus to using Java I would think.


    Rotor is out. The assault on Java's available-on-many-OSes advantage is on!.
    ;-)
    I still like jBoss and ANTLR though......

    Kunle



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