no break-edit-continue in newest vb.net?

[dan houck]

It looks like the newest vb.net (2003) won't have break-edit-continue either!
what is wrong with ms? The new language is great (it looks a little like
vb :-) but i won't recommend it (for productivity reasons) until they bring
back break-edit-continue!!

[Phil Weber]

> It looks like the newest vb.net (2003) won't have
> break-edit-continue either!

Dan: "Everett" is an incremental release. MS has promised
break-edit-continue for the next *major* release of VS.NET ("Visual Studio
for Yukon"). For more information, see
http://msdn.microsoft.com/vstudio/pr...fo/roadmap.asp .
--
Phil Weber

[Kunle Odutola]

dan houck wrote:
> It looks like the newest vb.net (2003) won't have break-edit-continue
> either! what is wrong with ms?

It was promised for [all applicable .NET languages for] the V2 release not a
V1.x release.

> The new language is great (it looks a
> little like vb :-) but i won't recommend it (for productivity
> reasons) until they bring back break-edit-continue!!

Would you recommend sleeping on the street in protest until the local telco
supports broadband too?. Or throwing the baby out with the bath water....

Kunle

[Mike Mitchell]

On Sat, 11 Jan 2003 07:27:32 -0000, "Kunle Odutola"
<kunle.odutola@REMOVETHISokocha.freeserve.co.uk> wrote:

>...... Or throwing the baby out with the bath water....

Huh, they should have bludgeoned the baby, then drowned it.

MM

[Paul Clement]

On Sun, 12 Jan 2003 15:55:54 +0000, Mike Mitchell <kylix_is@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

¤ On Sat, 11 Jan 2003 07:27:32 -0000, "Kunle Odutola"
¤ <kunle.odutola@REMOVETHISokocha.freeserve.co.uk> wrote:
¤
¤ >...... Or throwing the baby out with the bath water....
¤
¤ Huh, they should have bludgeoned the baby, then drowned it.

"Bitterness is the under-arm odor of wishful weakness. It is the graceless acknowledgment of
defeat." (Zora Neale Hurston)


Paul ~~~ pclement@ameritech.net
Microsoft MVP (Visual Basic)

[Kent]

Defeat is trying to port VB6 code to VB.Net.

Paul Clement <UseAdddressAtEndofMessage@swspectrum.com> wrote:
>On Sun, 12 Jan 2003 15:55:54 +0000, Mike Mitchell <kylix_is@yahoo.co.uk>
wrote:
>
>¤ On Sat, 11 Jan 2003 07:27:32 -0000, "Kunle Odutola"
>¤ <kunle.odutola@REMOVETHISokocha.freeserve.co.uk> wrote:
>¤
>¤ >...... Or throwing the baby out with the bath water....
>¤
>¤ Huh, they should have bludgeoned the baby, then drowned it.
>
>"Bitterness is the under-arm odor of wishful weakness. It is the graceless
acknowledgment
>of
>defeat." (Zora Neale Hurston)
>
>
>Paul ~~~ pclement@ameritech.net
>Microsoft MVP (Visual Basic)

[Paul Clement]

On 13 Jan 2003 12:32:27 -0800, "Kent" <kp@kp.org> wrote:

¤
¤ Defeat is trying to port VB6 code to VB.Net.
¤

It is the one who denies the battle that is truly defeated.


Paul ~~~ pclement@ameritech.net
Microsoft MVP (Visual Basic)

[Leonard Lobel]

Break-Edit-Continue is such a serious omission at present, that MS should
dedicate a team just on this alone, and release it as an incremental update
the moment it is completed, instead of rolling it in with Yukon which won't
be here any time soon.

"Phil Weber" <pweber@nospam.fawcette.com> wrote:
> > It looks like the newest vb.net (2003) won't have
> > break-edit-continue either!
>
>Dan: "Everett" is an incremental release. MS has promised
>break-edit-continue for the next *major* release of VS.NET ("Visual Studio
>for Yukon"). For more information, see
>http://msdn.microsoft.com/vstudio/pr...fo/roadmap.asp .
>--
>Phil Weber
>
>

[Mike Mitchell]

On 2 Feb 2003 12:35:24 -0800, "Leonard Lobel" <lennil@govdata.com>
wrote:

>
>Break-Edit-Continue is such a serious omission at present, that MS should
>dedicate a team just on this alone, and release it as an incremental update
>the moment it is completed, instead of rolling it in with Yukon which won't
>be here any time soon.

And memories will be dulled even more by the time Yukon gets here.
Maybe by then Break-Edit-Continue will be reprised in a considerably
watered down form. Without there being an interpreter I can't see how
it could be as good as classic VB's. For example, will one be able to
whack in a GoSub, then continue running the code?

MM

[Bob]

Mike Mitchell <kylix_is@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>On 2 Feb 2003 12:35:24 -0800, "Leonard Lobel" <lennil@govdata.com>
>wrote:

>And memories will be dulled even more by the time Yukon gets here.
>Maybe by then Break-Edit-Continue will be reprised in a considerably
>watered down form. Without there being an interpreter I can't see how
>it could be as good as classic VB's. For example, will one be able to
>whack in a GoSub, then continue running the code?
>
>MM
GoSub is history. You really should try harder to keep up.

[John Butler]

"Mike Mitchell" <kylix_is@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
news:d5ot3vgeclcdoat2sn2tqtkui0ir7s32te@4ax.com...
> >Break-Edit-Continue is such a serious omission at present, that MS should
> >dedicate a team just on this alone, and release it as an incremental
update
> >the moment it is completed, instead of rolling it in with Yukon which
won't
> >be here any time soon.

I'm sorry, but it really isn't _that_ big a deal. Would I prefer to have it
back? Sure. But I can live without it. It's certainly not a
showstopper...code properly and half the time you won't need it....and
yes...I know about the squillion business users who happily used to write
code and correct it as they went along...randomly hacking their way into an
app that sort of worked without breaking. We've been there...discussed
that..

rgds
John Butler

[Mike Mitchell]

On Tue, 4 Feb 2003 01:17:55 -0000, "John Butler"
<nospamjrbutler@btinternet.com> wrote:

>I'm sorry, but it really isn't _that_ big a deal. Would I prefer to have it
>back? Sure. But I can live without it. It's certainly not a
>showstopper...code properly and half the time you won't need it....and
>yes...I know about the squillion business users who happily used to write
>code and correct it as they went along...randomly hacking their way into an
>app that sort of worked without breaking. We've been there...discussed
>that..

Have you never heard of iterative prototyping? I continually harp on
about how the COMPUTER should be brought to bear on a task or
programming challenge by making the COMPUTER help out with planning,
testing, refining etc etc. But you say you can "live without"
break-edit-continue, which was one of the most powerful selling
features of Visual Basic! I simply fail to comprehend why you want to
do programming the hard way, when there are tools to facilitate the
easy way. Yes, there were/are squillions of business users who
utilised the RAD aspects of Visual Basic to turn the tool into a
universally acclaimed, unique development product, and one of those
aspects was most definitely break-edit-continue. If you are an
ordinary programmer writing code in, say, C, C++, Java and so on, then
the limitations of those languages, where the computer helps little to
help you, then fine, great, I can understand where you're coming from.
But Visual Basic users discovered that there is a much quicker, more
productive way to deliver applications and those apps are very largely
not produced through "randomly hacking" the code together by burger
flippers moonlighting as programmers! (Though I cannot discount the
possibility of stray dabs of beef fat finding their way on to the
keyboard.) Do you not realise that the ancient, arcane C/C++ route
towards producing application software by writing....writing...writing
reams and reams of code is so obsolescent nowadays, if it could grow a
beard it would be in the Guinness Book of Records.

MM

[Dave]

"John Butler" <nospamjrbutler@btinternet.com> wrote:
>I'm sorry, but it really isn't _that_ big a deal. Would I prefer to have
it
>back? Sure. But I can live without it. It's certainly not a
>showstopper...code properly and half the time you won't need it....and
>yes...I know about the squillion business users who happily used to write
>code and correct it as they went along...randomly hacking their way into
an
>app that sort of worked without breaking. We've been there...discussed
>that..

Don't be too hasty condemning one style of debugging. I've found that most
developers favor just one or two of the many debugging features of VB. Personally,
I rarely use anything other than a few breakpoints and a little bit of line
stepping: but it doesn't mean that I think anyone is nuts if they do otherwise.

[Bob]

Mike Mitchell <kylix_is@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>On Tue, 4 Feb 2003 01:17:55 -0000, "John Butler"
><nospamjrbutler@btinternet.com> wrote:
>
>>I'm sorry, but it really isn't _that_ big a deal. Would I prefer to have
it
>>back? Sure. But I can live without it. It's certainly not a
>>showstopper...code properly and half the time you won't need it....and
>>yes...I know about the squillion business users who happily used to write
>>code and correct it as they went along...randomly hacking their way into
an
>>app that sort of worked without breaking. We've been there...discussed
>>that..
>
>Have you never heard of iterative prototyping? I continually harp on
>about how the COMPUTER should be brought to bear on a task or
>programming challenge by making the COMPUTER help out with planning,
>testing, refining etc etc. But you say you can "live without"
>break-edit-continue, which was one of the most powerful selling
>features of Visual Basic! I simply fail to comprehend why you want to
>do programming the hard way, when there are tools to facilitate the
>easy way. Yes, there were/are squillions of business users who
>utilised the RAD aspects of Visual Basic to turn the tool into a
>universally acclaimed, unique development product, and one of those
>aspects was most definitely break-edit-continue. If you are an
>ordinary programmer writing code in, say, C, C++, Java and so on, then
>the limitations of those languages, where the computer helps little to
>help you, then fine, great, I can understand where you're coming from.
>But Visual Basic users discovered that there is a much quicker, more
>productive way to deliver applications and those apps are very largely
>not produced through "randomly hacking" the code together by burger
>flippers moonlighting as programmers! (Though I cannot discount the
>possibility of stray dabs of beef fat finding their way on to the
>keyboard.) Do you not realise that the ancient, arcane C/C++ route
>towards producing application software by writing....writing...writing
>reams and reams of code is so obsolescent nowadays, if it could grow a
>beard it would be in the Guinness Book of Records.
>
>MM
Every once in a while even MM makes a valid point.

[Kent]

"Dave" <dave_doknjas@yahoo.ca> wrote:
>Don't be too hasty condemning one style of debugging. I've found that most
>developers favor just one or two of the many debugging features of VB. Personally,
>I rarely use anything other than a few breakpoints and a little bit of line
>stepping: but it doesn't mean that I think anyone is nuts if they do otherwise.
>

Very well said.