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Thread: YAG: VB.Net or C#?

  1. #1
    Gary Nelson Guest

    YAG: VB.Net or C#?

    Yair,



    I'm faced with quite a perplexing situation, and as such would like to get
    your opinion.

    My situation:

    - My company gets 95% of its revenue from one program.

    - The program is now 17 years old (started 1985) and not finished
    yet (that is to say, it is fully functional, but every day we are adding new
    functionality)

    - It has been ported from gw-basic to BC, QB2, QB3, QB4, QB4.5, PDS
    6.0, PDS 7.0, PDS 7.1, VB1, VB2, VB3, VB4, to VB6 where it is now.

    - The program has

    o around 140,000 lines of code

    o around 1000 gosubs

    o hundreds of control arrays

    o extensive binary file I/O

    o extensive use of Mid$, Lset, etc.



    My dilemma:

    I plan to be selling this program 15+ years from now, therefore
    it must be ported, as I am sure VB6 will not last that long. A complete
    rewrite could take five years and cost hundreds of thousands of dollars. A
    port of existing code would take several months to a year.

    The million-dollar question is: What language should I port to?
    I would prefer VB.NET, because I have always programmed in BASIC, (except
    for some assembler back in the DOS days), but I am scared stiff. As I see
    it, C# is Microsoft's new baby and is getting and will get all of the
    attention. I'm not really sure why Microsoft has even brought out VB.NET
    except to entice the VB programmers to its new platform. The arbitrary
    incompatibilities brought into it lead me to believe that Microsoft doesn't
    really want us to use it, but would rather have us go to C#. It obviously is
    not in Microsoft's best interest to maintain two programs that essentially
    do the same thing, therefore it is quite possible, and even probable that
    one of them will be eliminated in the future. My bet is that if one has to
    go, it will be VB.NET.

    So I would like to ask you, as a Microsoft insider, what do you
    personally consider to be the future of VB.NET? If you had to bet a million
    dollars of YOUR money on it, where would you put it VB.NET or C#?



    Gary




  2. #2
    Jason Guest

    Re: YAG: VB.Net or C#?


    Port it to VB.NET, the compile it. Use a C# decompiler to extract C# code
    from your VB compiled code. Now you have ported it to two languages!

    Heh.

    In all seriousness, VB6 should continue to run for many years. There are
    numerous applications without funding for redevelopment, and Microsoft has
    a pretty good track record of providing minimal support for many years after
    they break compatibility. Look how long they supported the 16-bit version
    of VB4.

    Given your description of the application, I would say you are in need of
    a major overhaul, design-wise. 1000 gosubs? That isn't how we've done it
    in this industry for 10 years. The GUI development tools are also a lot
    better, and the underlying libraries are much more powerful. There are probably
    a lot of things you could do better without control arrays.

    Have you considered turning your application into a web app and selling it
    as an ASP, rather than as an application? You could even write the GUIs
    in VB.NET and deliver them over the web (absolute zero impact installation,
    just like an HTML page).

    It's good to think about maintaining the current app, but this is a really
    good time to think about how you can make it better. This new technology
    is very different from what you are used to, and there are a lot of possibilities
    that have just opened up for you. If you are anything like me, these are
    possibilities that you didn't even think of before you started looking at
    the new stuff.

    Open your mind, and good luck with your sales.

    As far as VB or C# goes, it really doesn't make much of a difference. The
    parts that port will port pretty well to either language. The parts that
    won't port will be as difficult in either language.

    If you are interested in cross platform, the Mono project will be supporting
    the entire .NET framework for both VB.NET and C#.NET, for Linux and Unix.

    Just pick your favorite and start porting. And again, good luck to you.

    "Gary Nelson" <gn@contanet.es> wrote:
    >Yair,
    >
    >
    >
    >I'm faced with quite a perplexing situation, and as such would like to get
    >your opinion.
    >
    >My situation:
    >
    >- My company gets 95% of its revenue from one program.
    >
    >- The program is now 17 years old (started 1985) and not finished
    >yet (that is to say, it is fully functional, but every day we are adding

    new
    >functionality)
    >
    >- It has been ported from gw-basic to BC, QB2, QB3, QB4, QB4.5,

    PDS
    >6.0, PDS 7.0, PDS 7.1, VB1, VB2, VB3, VB4, to VB6 where it is now.
    >
    >- The program has
    >
    >o around 140,000 lines of code
    >
    >o around 1000 gosubs
    >
    >o hundreds of control arrays
    >
    >o extensive binary file I/O
    >
    >o extensive use of Mid$, Lset, etc.
    >
    >
    >
    >My dilemma:
    >
    > I plan to be selling this program 15+ years from now, therefore
    >it must be ported, as I am sure VB6 will not last that long. A complete
    >rewrite could take five years and cost hundreds of thousands of dollars.

    A
    >port of existing code would take several months to a year.
    >
    > The million-dollar question is: What language should I port

    to?
    >I would prefer VB.NET, because I have always programmed in BASIC, (except
    >for some assembler back in the DOS days), but I am scared stiff. As I see
    >it, C# is Microsoft's new baby and is getting and will get all of the
    >attention. I'm not really sure why Microsoft has even brought out VB.NET
    >except to entice the VB programmers to its new platform. The arbitrary
    >incompatibilities brought into it lead me to believe that Microsoft doesn't
    >really want us to use it, but would rather have us go to C#. It obviously

    is
    >not in Microsoft's best interest to maintain two programs that essentially
    >do the same thing, therefore it is quite possible, and even probable that
    >one of them will be eliminated in the future. My bet is that if one has

    to
    >go, it will be VB.NET.
    >
    > So I would like to ask you, as a Microsoft insider, what do

    you
    >personally consider to be the future of VB.NET? If you had to bet a million
    >dollars of YOUR money on it, where would you put it VB.NET or C#?
    >
    >
    >
    >Gary
    >
    >
    >



  3. #3
    John Butler Guest

    Re: VB.Net or C#?


    "Gary Nelson" <gn@contanet.es> wrote in message news:3c5e52fd@10.1.10.29...

    > So I would like to ask you, as a Microsoft insider, what do

    you
    > personally consider to be the future of VB.NET? If you had to bet a

    million
    > dollars of YOUR money on it, where would you put it VB.NET or C#?


    I was very worried about VB vs C# too, but as I've got into DotNet, I've
    become less concerned. Ok, it helps that my angle is ASP.NET and that VB is
    the stronger language in this scenario, has many more examples and is
    clearly not going anywhere, anytime soon.(From the angle of existing VB
    script code, asp classic etc...obviously no language is really that much
    stronger than another under the CLR)

    Also, I've read a few books by some of the team who developed VB.NET, and
    it's clear there is a lot for passion for VB (at least, for now). If you
    believe what some of the team say, (and I do) then I think that no-one at MS
    made the step to break compatibility without some pain and considerable
    thought. One of the books mentioned that the team got some way down the road
    of trying to maintain compatibility, before they realise that the original
    VB itself was too cludged to re-cludge. It's one thing to keep adding to a
    product (VB1) code base over the years. bolting on functionality etc but
    another thing entirely to re-write a product from the ground up and still
    try and keep it working the same way (including all the highly-useful arcane
    hacks that people had come to know and love). So, in the end, they didn't
    and although I *****ed and moaned...I've got over it, for the most part.

    Using DotNet, I am busy getting some functionality going through a web
    browser that I never could have done before in VB/ASP Classic...and yes
    Mike, it involves <shock horror> web services....but they're never going
    near hailstorm/myservices..they're mine, all mine..bwooohahaha

    The break-edit-continue model will almost certainly be back...seems they
    just couldn't get it together for the initial release but I look forward to
    seeing it again. Till then, I'll content myself with the fact that (for
    starters) ASP.NET is now a very real and powerful way of doing things and
    the VB.NET that drives it is full of horsepower still waiting to be
    untapped. Some of it is painful, but then so is learning to ride a horse
    when you've only ever ridden a bicycle..

    rgds
    John Butler





  4. #4
    Yair Alan Griver [MS] Guest

    Re: VB.Net or C#?

    A couple of thoughts.

    1. I don't know that the team here would necessarily agree that they are
    arbitrary incompatibilities. Though I wasn't here at the time, I do know
    that a lot of thought went into the design of VB.NET.
    2. MS is very committed to the product.
    3. I don't know about a million of my own dollars, but I did bet my own
    career on VB.NET - and that's a pretty high bet <g>

    Bottom line, if you are more comfortable with VB, go for it. You have
    nothing to worry about...

    yag

    "Gary Nelson" <gn@contanet.es> wrote in message news:3c5e52fd@10.1.10.29...
    > Yair,
    >
    >
    >
    > I'm faced with quite a perplexing situation, and as such would like to get
    > your opinion.
    >
    > My situation:
    >
    > - My company gets 95% of its revenue from one program.
    >
    > - The program is now 17 years old (started 1985) and not finished
    > yet (that is to say, it is fully functional, but every day we are adding

    new
    > functionality)
    >
    > - It has been ported from gw-basic to BC, QB2, QB3, QB4, QB4.5,

    PDS
    > 6.0, PDS 7.0, PDS 7.1, VB1, VB2, VB3, VB4, to VB6 where it is now.
    >
    > - The program has
    >
    > o around 140,000 lines of code
    >
    > o around 1000 gosubs
    >
    > o hundreds of control arrays
    >
    > o extensive binary file I/O
    >
    > o extensive use of Mid$, Lset, etc.
    >
    >
    >
    > My dilemma:
    >
    > I plan to be selling this program 15+ years from now,

    therefore
    > it must be ported, as I am sure VB6 will not last that long. A complete
    > rewrite could take five years and cost hundreds of thousands of dollars. A
    > port of existing code would take several months to a year.
    >
    > The million-dollar question is: What language should I port

    to?
    > I would prefer VB.NET, because I have always programmed in BASIC, (except
    > for some assembler back in the DOS days), but I am scared stiff. As I see
    > it, C# is Microsoft's new baby and is getting and will get all of the
    > attention. I'm not really sure why Microsoft has even brought out VB.NET
    > except to entice the VB programmers to its new platform. The arbitrary
    > incompatibilities brought into it lead me to believe that Microsoft

    doesn't
    > really want us to use it, but would rather have us go to C#. It obviously

    is
    > not in Microsoft's best interest to maintain two programs that essentially
    > do the same thing, therefore it is quite possible, and even probable that
    > one of them will be eliminated in the future. My bet is that if one has to
    > go, it will be VB.NET.
    >
    > So I would like to ask you, as a Microsoft insider, what do

    you
    > personally consider to be the future of VB.NET? If you had to bet a

    million
    > dollars of YOUR money on it, where would you put it VB.NET or C#?
    >
    >
    >
    > Gary
    >
    >
    >




  5. #5
    Gary Nelson Guest

    Re: YAG: VB.Net or C#?

    Jason,

    > In all seriousness, VB6 should continue to run for many years. There are
    > numerous applications without funding for redevelopment, and Microsoft has
    > a pretty good track record of providing minimal support for many years

    after
    > they break compatibility. Look how long they supported the 16-bit version
    > of VB4.


    I'm not worried about my VB6 application no working in the near future. I
    would guess that there will be no problem with that for many years. The
    problem is that there are going to be things that I'm going to want to do
    that are going to be much more dificult to do, if not impossible in VB6.
    (Don't ask me what they are, I don't know yet, but it's always been that
    way).

    > Given your description of the application, I would say you are in need of
    > a major overhaul, design-wise. 1000 gosubs? That isn't how we've done it
    > in this industry for 10 years.


    Sure, but remember I come from gw-basic. By the way, a lot of people don't
    know that in VB6 you can add a gosub while in break-edit-continue, but you
    can't add a sub. In a large program, where you are deep into it, that can
    make development much faster.

    > The GUI development tools are also a lot
    > better, and the underlying libraries are much more powerful. There are

    probably
    > a lot of things you could do better without control arrays.


    I like the way in VB.Net you can create arrays of different controls, but it
    is a shame that they didn't include control arrays. Did anyone know that
    control arrays would be phased out?

    > Have you considered turning your application into a web app and selling it
    > as an ASP, rather than as an application? You could even write the GUIs
    > in VB.NET and deliver them over the web (absolute zero impact

    installation,
    > just like an HTML page).


    Sure... that might be in the future, but still is a long way off. The web is
    not secure enough yet for people to leave the kind of data we handle on a
    remote server.

    > It's good to think about maintaining the current app, but this is a really
    > good time to think about how you can make it better. This new technology
    > is very different from what you are used to, and there are a lot of

    possibilities
    > that have just opened up for you. If you are anything like me, these are
    > possibilities that you didn't even think of before you started looking at
    > the new stuff.


    I like new stuff too. Even though I still use gosubs, my program has 3
    homemade dlls, 2 homemade ocxs (one of which is a circular dbgrid that rolls
    through a million record database like a hot knife through butter), plus a
    remote ole server.

    > Open your mind, and good luck with your sales.


    Thanks,

    Gary



  6. #6
    Gary Nelson Guest

    Re: VB.Net or C#?

    Yair,

    Thanks for the answer.

    > 1. I don't know that the team here would necessarily agree that they are
    > arbitrary incompatibilities. Though I wasn't here at the time, I do know
    > that a lot of thought went into the design of VB.NET.


    I see a lot of little things that (in my opinion) don't affect the CLR, that
    could have been more compatible.
    Also it would have been nice if something had been included to make it
    easier to port gosubs. Say inline macros or something like that. Something
    that a conversion routine could translate to without difficulty. Also, it
    would have been nice if control arrays had been kept.

    > 2. MS is very committed to the product.


    > 3. I don't know about a million of my own dollars, but I did bet my own
    > career on VB.NET - and that's a pretty high bet <g>
    > Bottom line, if you are more comfortable with VB, go for it. You have
    > nothing to worry about...


    I hope so, but you can't blame me for having my doubts.

    Gary



  7. #7
    Mike Mitchell Guest

    Re: VB.Net or C#?

    On Mon, 4 Feb 2002 22:43:20 -0000, "John Butler"
    <nospamjrbutler@btinternet.com> wrote:

    >rgds


    Well, for me the only benefit of VB.NET is that it will drive many
    more existing users, clients and corporates towards looking at other
    alternative platforms for the first time, and I suppose that that
    alone is enough reason to be cheerful!

    MM

  8. #8
    Mike Mitchell Guest

    Re: YAG: VB.Net or C#?

    On Tue, 5 Feb 2002 09:56:38 -0000, "Gary Nelson" <gn@contanet.es>
    wrote:

    >Sure, but remember I come from gw-basic. By the way, a lot of people don't
    >know that in VB6 you can add a gosub while in break-edit-continue, but you
    >can't add a sub. In a large program, where you are deep into it, that can
    >make development much faster.


    Yeah, maybe the purists wouldn't ever dare to do something like that
    with GoSub (I did it often) and so they never explored every avenue
    that RAD has to offer. Well, RAD as exemplified by classic VB anyways.

    MM

  9. #9
    Kathleen \(MS MVP\) Guest

    Re: VB.Net or C#?

    Gary,

    You asked YAG, so I don't know if you want my opinion, but here is a brief
    one.

    > o around 140,000 lines of code


    I don't know your code base. I have a 300KLOC application that I expect the
    KLOC to drop by 75% (to well under 100KLOC. Haven't got the money to do it
    unfortunately. The cost to rewrite this application will be considerably
    less than porting it IMO, and we will have something maintainable.

    > o around 1000 gosubs


    With all due respect, is my memory wrong? I thought you said a couple of
    months ago that the most common reason you used GoSubs was to avoid stopping
    and restarting IDE debugging. If that is the reason, don't you think it is
    time to clean up those GoSubs into well named procedures?

    > o hundreds of control arrays


    There is a good answer to this, and I am surprised it is not getting more
    press. You modify the approach that the conversion team did, but you do a
    cleaner job because it is your code. Basically, you provide an extender and
    define groups of controls (can be VB6 style or more sophisticated) and let
    the extender hook up the events. It could be used for other purposes. If
    there was a reason other than events that leads you to anticipate problems
    with control arrays we can discuss. Each reason you used them has a separate
    solution, but I think they are all superior solutions.

    > o extensive binary file I/O


    If you use the compatibility library you are talking about adding some
    parens and other superficial stuff that the wizard should do for you. If you
    want sophisticated IO, there are great opportunities in .NET.

    > o extensive use of Mid$, Lset, etc.


    I don't know of a problem with Mid, although you will probably use the $ if
    is a search and replace by you or a wizard. LSet may be more problematic,
    but if you discuss why you use it, there is probably a good solution.

    > My dilemma:
    >
    > I plan to be selling this program 15+ years from now,

    therefore
    > it must be ported, as I am sure VB6 will not last that long. A complete
    > rewrite could take five years and cost hundreds of thousands of dollars. A
    > port of existing code would take several months to a year.


    I am exceedingly skeptical that your rewrite could take five years or
    hundreds of thousands of dollars. I anticipate rewriting the 300KLOC legacy
    app that I still maintain to be less than a year and less than 200K at my
    rates.

    > The million-dollar question is: What language should I port

    to?
    > I would prefer VB.NET, because I have always programmed in BASIC, (except
    > for some assembler back in the DOS days), but I am scared stiff.


    Postpone the decision until you know .NET enough to be confident in your
    decision. Once you get over a certain hump in the learning curve, you will
    be excited to do the rewrite.

    > As I see
    > it, C# is Microsoft's new baby and is getting and will get all of the
    > attention.


    I think this is bullshit, but I have said that before. I don't know what
    else to say unless you want an argument on the subject.

    > I'm not really sure why Microsoft has even brought out VB.NET
    > except to entice the VB programmers to its new platform.


    Bullshit. It is the main show. Why would you think otherwise. C# is for the
    Java and C people. Hardly the main game.

    > The arbitrary
    > incompatibilities brought into it lead me to believe that Microsoft

    doesn't
    > really want us to use it, but would rather have us go to C#.


    Look, you know I don't agree everything that was done. There was a set of
    changes I fought against, another set I still want to see fixed. But this
    isn't the thread for that.

    The bulk of the changes is what lead me to believe that MS is committed to
    VB and it is the main show. They did not simply wrap up a syntax, but they
    created a robust language with no limits that are not in C# in well. Look
    closely at the framework. It has the verbosity, and clarity that
    characterizes VB, not C#. They start saving characters in the framework,
    I'll look for another vendor.

    > It obviously is
    > not in Microsoft's best interest to maintain two programs that essentially
    > do the same thing, therefore it is quite possible, and even probable that
    > one of them will be eliminated in the future. My bet is that if one has to
    > go, it will be VB.NET.


    It quite obviously is in their interest. It is in their interest to get the
    widest number and range of programs written in their languages. The still
    support and enhance FoxPro for crying out loud. Have you seen Balmer's
    "Developers" video. That is real, because that is their long term bottom
    line and survival.

    > So I would like to ask you, as a Microsoft insider, what do

    you
    > personally consider to be the future of VB.NET? If you had to bet a

    million
    > dollars of YOUR money on it, where would you put it VB.NET or C#?


    If I was looking at a million dollar development (and you said half) I would
    worry about a lot of things other than which of these two languages. I would
    go with VB because it is easier to understand, therefore, I believe I will
    always be able to get maintenance programmers up to speed quicker and
    because I enjoy it so much more. There are big questions for you if you are
    going forward: how much do you commit to the Internet, how do you handle
    security, what will be your architecture and deployment.

    I reiterate my earlier suggestion. If you have this much on the line, spend
    $10,000 truly coming up to speed on .NET or hiring someone who is to do a
    prototype for you. Don't take that step until you are comfortable, because I
    am quite sure if you take the time with .NET you will in fact jump head
    first into it without your current level of concern.

    Kathlen



  10. #10
    Mike Mitchell Guest

    Re: VB.Net or C#?

    On Wed, 6 Feb 2002 11:49:39 -0700, "Kathleen \(MS MVP\)"
    <someone@nomail.com> wrote:

    >...... The still
    >support and enhance FoxPro for crying out loud.


    Yeah, they can do it for an obscure, little-used programming tool like
    VFP, but not, seeminlgy, for their erstwhile flagship programming
    language, Visual Basic! (Thinks...) How weird *is* their world!

    > Have you seen Balmer's
    >"Developers" video. That is real, because that is their long term bottom
    >line and survival.


    Unreal, more like. I have never, ever seen anything more frightening,
    embarrassing, or just plain crazy as the sight of the big guy bouncing
    across the stage in some kind of frenzy. Any company afraid of
    survival which has to resort to these kinds of lobotomy impaired dance
    routines must be REALLY afraid!

    MM

  11. #11
    Karl E. Peterson Guest

    Re: VB.Net or C#?

    Hi Yag --

    > 1. I don't know that the team here would necessarily agree that they are
    > arbitrary incompatibilities. Though I wasn't here at the time, I do know
    > that a lot of thought went into the design of VB.NET.


    Yeah, "gratuitous" is a better word to describe the wantonness of it. Defend the
    loss of Wend. Go ahead. A lot of thought, my ***. Your reply in this case is about
    as condescending as they come.

    > 2. MS is very committed to the product.


    LOL!

    > 3. I don't know about a million of my own dollars, but I did bet my own
    > career on VB.NET - and that's a pretty high bet <g>


    Good thing you're already independently wealthy.

    > Bottom line, if you are more comfortable with VB, go for it. You have
    > nothing to worry about...


    Know a guy named Drew Fletcher? Ask him what words of that nature mean to him, in
    this context, next time you bump into him, eh? (Tell him I sent ya.)

    Later... Karl
    --
    [Microsoft Basic: 1976-2001, RIP]


  12. #12
    Yair Alan Griver [MS] Guest

    Re: VB.Net or C#?

    Missed you Karl! Where the heck have ya been? <g> You gonna be at VSLive?

    yag

    --

    Yair Alan Griver
    Lead PM/Evangelist
    Microsoft Corporation

    This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no rights.

    "Karl E. Peterson" <karl@mvps.org> wrote in message
    news:3c61ddfe$1@10.1.10.29...
    > Hi Yag --
    >
    > > 1. I don't know that the team here would necessarily agree that they are
    > > arbitrary incompatibilities. Though I wasn't here at the time, I do know
    > > that a lot of thought went into the design of VB.NET.

    >
    > Yeah, "gratuitous" is a better word to describe the wantonness of it.

    Defend the
    > loss of Wend. Go ahead. A lot of thought, my ***. Your reply in this

    case is about
    > as condescending as they come.
    >
    > > 2. MS is very committed to the product.

    >
    > LOL!
    >
    > > 3. I don't know about a million of my own dollars, but I did bet my own
    > > career on VB.NET - and that's a pretty high bet <g>

    >
    > Good thing you're already independently wealthy.
    >
    > > Bottom line, if you are more comfortable with VB, go for it. You have
    > > nothing to worry about...

    >
    > Know a guy named Drew Fletcher? Ask him what words of that nature mean to

    him, in
    > this context, next time you bump into him, eh? (Tell him I sent ya.)
    >
    > Later... Karl
    > --
    > [Microsoft Basic: 1976-2001, RIP]
    >




  13. #13
    Kathleen \(MS MVP\) Guest

    Re: VB.Net or C#?

    Mike,

    > Yeah, they can do it for an obscure, little-used programming tool like
    > VFP, but not, seeminlgy, for their erstwhile flagship programming
    > language, Visual Basic! (Thinks...) How weird *is* their world!


    FoxPro has been through jumps with code incompatibilities far greater than
    the VB/VB.NET jump.

    Kathleen




  14. #14
    Mike Mitchell Guest

    Re: VB.Net or C#?

    On Wed, 6 Feb 2002 21:01:48 -0700, "Kathleen \(MS MVP\)"
    <someone@nomail.com> wrote:

    >FoxPro has been through jumps with code incompatibilities far greater than
    >the VB/VB.NET jump.


    Yeah, well when you've only got 14 and a half users, it's not got
    quite the same impact as three million.

    Oh, *now* you're gonna tell me I'm wrong. It's more like 15 and a
    half....?

    MM

  15. #15
    Karl E. Peterson Guest

    Re: VB.Net or C#?

    Hi Alan --

    Been out awhile, as my wife had some surgery. No, I really haven't found anything
    (friends aside) to justify the trip, this year.

    Sorry... Karl
    --
    [Microsoft Basic: 1976-2001, RIP]


    "Yair Alan Griver [MS]" <yag@microsoft.com> wrote in message
    news:3c61eff5$1@10.1.10.29...
    > Missed you Karl! Where the heck have ya been? <g> You gonna be at VSLive?
    >
    > yag
    >
    > --
    >
    > Yair Alan Griver
    > Lead PM/Evangelist
    > Microsoft Corporation
    >
    > This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no rights.
    >
    > "Karl E. Peterson" <karl@mvps.org> wrote in message
    > news:3c61ddfe$1@10.1.10.29...
    > > Hi Yag --
    > >
    > > > 1. I don't know that the team here would necessarily agree that they are
    > > > arbitrary incompatibilities. Though I wasn't here at the time, I do know
    > > > that a lot of thought went into the design of VB.NET.

    > >
    > > Yeah, "gratuitous" is a better word to describe the wantonness of it.

    > Defend the
    > > loss of Wend. Go ahead. A lot of thought, my ***. Your reply in this

    > case is about
    > > as condescending as they come.
    > >
    > > > 2. MS is very committed to the product.

    > >
    > > LOL!
    > >
    > > > 3. I don't know about a million of my own dollars, but I did bet my own
    > > > career on VB.NET - and that's a pretty high bet <g>

    > >
    > > Good thing you're already independently wealthy.
    > >
    > > > Bottom line, if you are more comfortable with VB, go for it. You have
    > > > nothing to worry about...

    > >
    > > Know a guy named Drew Fletcher? Ask him what words of that nature mean to

    > him, in
    > > this context, next time you bump into him, eh? (Tell him I sent ya.)
    > >
    > > Later... Karl
    > > --
    > > [Microsoft Basic: 1976-2001, RIP]
    > >

    >
    >



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