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Thread: 3rd party component suites

  1. #1
    Robert Fuchs Guest

    3rd party component suites

    Hello,

    in the recent days we downloaded and shortly tested many components and
    found the following of most value:

    Infragistics NetAdvantage Suite 2.0
    www.infragistics.com

    ComponentOne Studio for .NET or ComponentOne Studio Enterprise
    www.componentone.com

    Syncfusion Essential Suite
    www.syncfusion.com

    Developer Express Subscription
    www.devexpress.com

    But: these products are rather large and comprehensive, so I think we
    would need some weeks to test them thorughly to make a decision which to
    buy.

    Anybody out there, who is using one or more of them, and can give us a
    short conclusion/testimonial, so that we can save some valuable time?

    regards, Robert

    PS: we use VS.NET, C# and MS SQL 2k (MSDN Univ.), our main business is
    developing classical client/server database applications.


  2. #2
    Jay Glynn Guest

    Re: 3rd party component suites


    "Robert Fuchs" <software@microfox.donotspam.at> wrote:
    >Hello,
    >
    >in the recent days we downloaded and shortly tested many components and
    >found the following of most value:
    >
    >Infragistics NetAdvantage Suite 2.0
    >www.infragistics.com
    >
    >ComponentOne Studio for .NET or ComponentOne Studio Enterprise
    >www.componentone.com
    >
    >Syncfusion Essential Suite
    >www.syncfusion.com
    >
    >Developer Express Subscription
    >www.devexpress.com
    >
    >But: these products are rather large and comprehensive, so I think we
    >would need some weeks to test them thorughly to make a decision which to
    >buy.
    >
    >Anybody out there, who is using one or more of them, and can give us a
    >short conclusion/testimonial, so that we can save some valuable time?
    >
    >regards, Robert
    >
    >PS: we use VS.NET, C# and MS SQL 2k (MSDN Univ.), our main business is
    >developing classical client/server database applications.
    >



    I've been using Infragistics grid control for a while now. It has some nice
    features, but the object model is entirely to complex. Part of the problem
    is the documentation for the grid is woefully inadequate.

    We used ComponentOne products in the COM world and have had reasonably good
    luck with them. I have found that ComponentOne is a little more difficult
    to work with then VideoSoft was. We had a very good relationship with VideoSoft
    and that seems to have dissapeared with ComponentOne.

    We are leaning towards not using suites, but going best of breed for any
    controls that we utilize. Currently I'm looking very closely at Xceeds grid.
    It is built to be extended and I like that idea. As far as any other controls,
    I'm finding that it really doesn't take a lot of effort to add the functionality
    I need to the current control set.

  3. #3
    Miha Markic Guest

    Re: 3rd party component suites

    I am 100% on Developer Express.

    Miha



  4. #4
    Robert Fuchs Guest

    Re: 3rd party component suites

    > We are leaning towards not using suites, but going best of breed for
    any
    > controls that we utilize. Currently I'm looking very closely at Xceeds

    grid.
    > It is built to be extended and I like that idea. As far as any other

    controls,
    > I'm finding that it really doesn't take a lot of effort to add the

    functionality
    > I need to the current control set.


    Did you buy Xceeds grid or just evaluate? Evaluating time is only 20
    days, this is too short for me.
    Can you tell me more about it?
    Do you use it in production?
    Do you need the source code version to extend it?

    regards, Robert


  5. #5
    Robert Fuchs Guest

    Re: 3rd party component suites

    > I am 100% on Developer Express.
    >
    > Miha


    are you an employee of Developer Express or other somehow related?

    What about Bugs?
    Do they respond fast, if you report a bug?
    Can you tell me more?

    regards, Robert


  6. #6
    Miha Markic Guest

    Re: 3rd party component suites

    Hi Robert,

    > are you an employee of Developer Express or other somehow related?
    >


    I am a member of their volunteer support team DXSquad (www.dxsquad.com) and
    also a happy customer.

    > What about Bugs?


    No bugs. Just kidding
    Certainly there is no product without bugs however Developer Express has an
    excellent reputation of releasing bug-free products.

    > Do they respond fast, if you report a bug?


    Yes, specially if you are a subscriber. Support is normaly via e-mail.

    > Can you tell me more?


    About what?
    You might check their website there is plenty of info.
    If you have specific questions, go ahead.

    Just one thing that you might find interesting. The whole .NET package
    somewhat integrated in a good way: you can use the same editor control
    within grid, within toolbar (XtraBar), within TreeList or standalone.
    IOW, if you create (or derive) your own control you can use it efortless
    within all of the above.

    Miha



  7. #7
    Jay Glynn Guest

    Re: 3rd party component suites


    "Robert Fuchs" <software@microfox.donotspam.at> wrote:
    >> We are leaning towards not using suites, but going best of breed for

    >any
    >> controls that we utilize. Currently I'm looking very closely at Xceeds

    >grid.
    >> It is built to be extended and I like that idea. As far as any other

    >controls,
    >> I'm finding that it really doesn't take a lot of effort to add the

    >functionality
    >> I need to the current control set.

    >
    >Did you buy Xceeds grid or just evaluate? Evaluating time is only 20
    >days, this is too short for me.
    >Can you tell me more about it?
    >Do you use it in production?
    >Do you need the source code version to extend it?
    >
    >regards, Robert
    >


    I have just done evals at this point. We already own Infragistics grid, and
    I noticed that they just came out with v2 which is supposed to resolve some
    of the problems that I had with v1.

    I agree that 20 days isn't a lot of time. I liked the way VideoSoft did their
    evals. Use them as long as you want, you just get to see the nag screen once
    in a while.

  8. #8
    Jay Glynn Guest

    Re: 3rd party component suites


    "Miha Markic" <miham@pleasenospam.spin.si> wrote:
    >Hi Robert,
    >
    >> are you an employee of Developer Express or other somehow related?
    >>

    >
    >I am a member of their volunteer support team DXSquad (www.dxsquad.com)

    and
    >also a happy customer.
    >
    >> What about Bugs?

    >
    >No bugs. Just kidding
    >Certainly there is no product without bugs however Developer Express has

    an
    >excellent reputation of releasing bug-free products.
    >
    >> Do they respond fast, if you report a bug?

    >
    >Yes, specially if you are a subscriber. Support is normaly via e-mail.
    >
    >> Can you tell me more?

    >
    >About what?
    >You might check their website there is plenty of info.
    >If you have specific questions, go ahead.
    >
    >Just one thing that you might find interesting. The whole .NET package
    >somewhat integrated in a good way: you can use the same editor control
    >within grid, within toolbar (XtraBar), within TreeList or standalone.
    >IOW, if you create (or derive) your own control you can use it efortless
    >within all of the above.
    >
    >Miha
    >
    >


    That's all well and good, but since they wouldn't let me eval a copy, I'll
    never give them serious consideration for any of their controls. Watching
    a lame demo isn't an adequate way to evaluate a control.

  9. #9
    Robert Fuchs Guest

    Re: 3rd party component suites

    > I have just done evals at this point. We already own Infragistics
    grid, and
    > I noticed that they just came out with v2 which is supposed to resolve

    some
    > of the problems that I had with v1.


    Don't think so.
    Following is what somebody answered to my question in MS C# group:

    <snip>
    Infragistics is by far ahead of the others in pure functionality with
    thier
    latest release.

    HOWEVER!

    Both V1 and V2 of their WinForms controls (and from what I've tested of
    their ASP.net controls they are the same) are buggy as ****. Yes, they
    are
    responding and fixing them, but they dumped V2 out the door knowing that
    there was still almost 100 bugs reported that hadn't been fixed and some
    of
    them are so obvious it isn't funny, such as putting a toolbar on a mdi
    child
    will crash your app when you close the mdi child etc.

    ComponentOne hasn't been much better if you read the news groups and the
    review in Visual Studio Magazine.
    </snip>

    regards, Robert


  10. #10
    Jay Glynn Guest

    Re: 3rd party component suites


    "Robert Fuchs" <software@microfox.donotspam.at> wrote:
    >> I have just done evals at this point. We already own Infragistics

    >grid, and
    >> I noticed that they just came out with v2 which is supposed to resolve

    >some
    >> of the problems that I had with v1.

    >
    >Don't think so.
    >Following is what somebody answered to my question in MS C# group:
    >
    ><snip>
    >Infragistics is by far ahead of the others in pure functionality with
    >thier
    >latest release.
    >
    >HOWEVER!
    >
    >Both V1 and V2 of their WinForms controls (and from what I've tested of
    >their ASP.net controls they are the same) are buggy as ****. Yes, they
    >are
    >responding and fixing them, but they dumped V2 out the door knowing that
    >there was still almost 100 bugs reported that hadn't been fixed and some
    >of
    >them are so obvious it isn't funny, such as putting a toolbar on a mdi
    >child
    >will crash your app when you close the mdi child etc.
    >
    >ComponentOne hasn't been much better if you read the news groups and the
    >review in Visual Studio Magazine.
    ></snip>
    >
    >regards, Robert
    >


    Well there you go....
    I'm in a position where I need to make a decision in the next week or so.
    I'm going to dl the new Infragistics grid control and see what it can do.
    I'm still leaning to Xceed however. You don't need the source in order to
    extend the control, you can just inherit what parts of it you need to extend.
    I like it better because the object model is a little cleaner then Infragistics
    and I really don't need much as far as bells and whistles.

  11. #11
    Miha Markic Guest

    Re: 3rd party component suites

    Hi Jay,

    > That's all well and good, but since they wouldn't let me eval a copy, I'll
    > never give them serious consideration for any of their controls. Watching
    > a lame demo isn't an adequate way to evaluate a control.


    IMO 60 days *unconditional* money back guarantee is not that bad.
    You get a fully functional version instead of some form of cripled one...
    But hey, that is your decision afterall.

    Miha



  12. #12
    Jay Glynn Guest

    Re: 3rd party component suites


    "Miha Markic" <miham.nospam@spamno.spin.si> wrote:
    >Hi Jay,
    >
    >> That's all well and good, but since they wouldn't let me eval a copy,

    I'll
    >> never give them serious consideration for any of their controls. Watching
    >> a lame demo isn't an adequate way to evaluate a control.

    >
    >IMO 60 days *unconditional* money back guarantee is not that bad.
    >You get a fully functional version instead of some form of cripled one...
    >But hey, that is your decision afterall.
    >
    >Miha
    >
    >



    The problem is that I work for a very large corporation and it takes a list
    of approvals and a pile of red tape about 3 feet high in order to purchase
    anything. I'm not going to go through all of that to see if I like it. The
    process to return something is just as bad. It would end up costing my company
    money in the long run. It's costing them sales and I told them so.

  13. #13
    Jason Guest

    Re: 3rd party component suites


    "Jay Glynn" <jlsglynn@hotmail.com> wrote:
    >
    >"Miha Markic" <miham.nospam@spamno.spin.si> wrote:
    >>Hi Jay,
    >>
    >>> That's all well and good, but since they wouldn't let me eval a copy,

    >I'll
    >>> never give them serious consideration for any of their controls. Watching
    >>> a lame demo isn't an adequate way to evaluate a control.

    >>
    >>IMO 60 days *unconditional* money back guarantee is not that bad.
    >>You get a fully functional version instead of some form of cripled one...
    >>But hey, that is your decision afterall.
    >>
    >>Miha

    >
    >The problem is that I work for a very large corporation and it takes a list
    >of approvals and a pile of red tape about 3 feet high in order to purchase
    >anything. I'm not going to go through all of that to see if I like it. The
    >process to return something is just as bad. It would end up costing my company
    >money in the long run. It's costing them sales and I told them so.


    Jay is correct. I never buy a control without first evaluating it for the
    specific purpose at hand, and I would try all controls with free evaluation
    periods before I would try something where I had to ask for my money back.


    Here is the problem I have with that. If I am evaluating, I can't voucher
    the product. If the product is charged to my card, I have to pay it off
    or pay interest on the amount. I can't voucher it with my company until
    I am sure we will keep it because then it involves multiple people and paperwork.
    In other words, in any case it is a big fat pain in the rump.

    If everyone else is offering eval periods, it does not matter if they blow
    everyone else away and have the best product ever. They are going to have
    a hard time selling the product, and poor cash flow leads to poor support.
    That leads to cancelled products.

    If they change their policy, I'll take a look.

  14. #14
    Jason Guest

    Re: 3rd party component suites


    "Jay Glynn" <jlsglynn@hotmail.com> wrote:
    >We are leaning towards not using suites, but going best of breed for any
    >controls that we utilize. Currently I'm looking very closely at Xceeds grid.
    >It is built to be extended and I like that idea. As far as any other controls,
    >I'm finding that it really doesn't take a lot of effort to add the functionality
    >I need to the current control set.


    What do you think of the grid control that comes with .NET as compared to
    others you have tried? Is it adequate for most tasks, or is it just a showpiece,
    like the crippled grid controls that have shipped with VB since day one?

    Also, I love "Professional C#." And I'm using the first edition even. Which
    chapters did you write?

  15. #15
    Robert Fuchs Guest

    Re: 3rd party component suites


    > Well there you go....
    > I'm in a position where I need to make a decision in the next week or

    so.
    > I'm going to dl the new Infragistics grid control and see what it can

    do.
    > I'm still leaning to Xceed however. You don't need the source in order

    to
    > extend the control, you can just inherit what parts of it you need to

    extend.
    > I like it better because the object model is a little cleaner then

    Infragistics
    > and I really don't need much as far as bells and whistles.


    would you please be so kind and post your Infragistics test results here
    or send me an email, to help me make my decision.

    Thanks, Robert
    (remove donotspam from email adress)


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